Tithing: Technical Questions

5 Flares Twitter 5 Facebook 0 Google+ 0 StumbleUpon 0 Email -- Filament.io 5 Flares ×

I have never paid tithing.

I understand that it’s a pretty personal topic, but I’ve got a couple of tithing scenarios which I do not fully understand.

Tithing is paid on one’s increase. No refunds are given for one’s decrease (omitting for the time being church assistance programs etc.)

So if I bought my house for $200,000 and I sell it for $300,000, do I owe the church $10,000?

Another situation would involve stock market or similar profit vehicles.

If I buy a stock at $1/share and I sell a stock at $2/share, do I owe the church $.10 for every share I sell? Would I just wait and tally all of my stock profits until the end of the year and pay on the increase?

78 thoughts on “Tithing: Technical Questions

  1. ltbugaf is the expert. I expect he knows how it works much better than I would. I thought it sounded like a Utah thing when it was explained to me.

  2. Actually, what I mean is that the “tithing free bond” is a complete fairy tale and that you shouldn’t fall for it, David. I hope I didn’t make you think otherwise.

  3. I did not pay the Tithe Free bonds of much mind. It was something I would be part of, so just dismissed the idea of it.

  4. The whole concept doesn’t even make sense. You buy “receipts”? You donate a “receipt” to the Church? No, you donate money to the Church. And you can’t claim a lump sum against your taxes in one year for a donation made in installments over the course of several years. No such scheme exists; if it does, it’s a scheme to cheat the gullible, and the Church has nothing to do with it.

  5. Perhaps your stake does not participate because it does not have the income to afford it. It never hurts to ask your SP if it is available in your stake.

  6. We have never heard of this either. We get receipts for filing our taxes, on tithing and offerings paid, but I have never heard of any of our American friends referring to “Tithing bonds” either. Sounds fishy to me. I agree with ltbugaf, if these scheme exists, it is not Church sanctioned. If so George, please provide a valid resource (anecdotes don’t count).

  7. So if someone gives me food or feeds me dinner, do I have to pay tithing on that too?

    I’ve just read over these comments and it’s like running around in a circle. Don’t ask others what you should pay for tithing, ask Heavenly Father. He’ll tell you. If you feel good about it and feel you are being honest in your dealings then you’re golden. It’s as simple as that.

  8. Well think about it George. Someone feeding you is an increase in money you aren’t spending on food. That is…if you want to get technical. Basically I just wanted to point out that most of the comments on this blog are pointless. Do we tithe gifts of money? Some do and some don’t. It’s a personal choice. Do you tithe the cost of a sweater you get as a gift? If a friend buys you a treat that’s an increase, do you tithe it? Basically, lets just leave it up to us and Heavenly Father. If you are at peace with your choice then that’s all that matters. Arguing about it here is pointless.

  9. Child support does not equal an income, however….Alimony is income and can be tithed. My ex is not a member so he will not be paying tithing in his income, but that is not my place to decide.

    He also pays for my education, also non income as it was agreed upon as his obligation in the divorce.

    Upon completion and when I work, all my income incuding alimony, NOT including child support will be eligble to be tithed.

    I look at it this way…. Ex is an employer.

    Child Support is exact expenses claimed for providing a service, not a profit. I use 100% of CS for children. i.e. expense reports are not income.

    Alimony is payment for services rendered (like a salary) in caring for the children and supporting him for the duration of the marriage and is an increase.

    clear enough.

    Prior to divorce, husband was non-member, I paid tithing based on my disposable part of the income for my benefit only. The bishop agreed that I should not try and pay on the total household income as it would cause family friction since he was oppossed to it.

    You can always tithe more if you want, but in the end it is up to you and the Lord.

  10. As a pastor, there are two things I have never done. I never presented this “new teaching” – as “the tithe,” and I never laid this man-made concoction on the brethren – claiming God requires 10% of one’s gross earnings to go in cash to the local church for life. What I have taught is: “If anyone does not provide for his own, and especially those of his own household, he has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever” (1Tim 5:8) and “Owe nothing to anyone” (Ro 13:8).

    If you would like to test your knowledge on the Tithe, I have a twenty question pop quiz you can take. It is totally private. I then have a free ebook for you, “No Tithe for the Christian.”

  11. Is tithing a Catholic thing or a Christian thing? I was born and raised Roman Catholic and I’ve never heard of anything like this, I thought it was always just give what you can, but I am from a poor town. My dad mentioned something like this I think once, can’t remember, and he was Methodist.

  12. Have you read the bible? Many scriptures talk about the importance of tithing:

    Heb. 7: 5-6, 8-9
    5 And verily they that are of the sons of Levi, who receive the office of the priesthood, have a commandment to take tithes of the people according to the law, that is, of their brethren, though they come out of the loins of Abraham:
    6 But he whose descent is not counted from them received tithes of Abraham, and blessed him that had the promises.
    • • •
    8 And here men that die receive tithes; but there he receiveth them, of whom it is witnessed that he liveth.
    9 And as I may so say, Levi also, who receiveth tithes, payed tithes in Abraham.

    Neh. 10: 37-38
    37 And that we should bring the firstfruits of our dough, and our offerings, and the fruit of all manner of trees, of wine and of oil, unto the priests, to the chambers of the house of our God; and the tithes of our ground unto the Levites, that the same Levites might have the tithes in all the cities of our tillage.
    38 And the priest the son of Aaron shall be with the Levites, when the Levites take tithes: and the Levites shall bring up the tithe of the tithes unto the house of our God, to the chambers, into the treasure house.

    Num. 18: 24, 26, 28
    24 But the tithes of the children of Israel, which they offer as an heave offering unto the Lord, I have given to the Levites to inherit: therefore I have said unto them, Among the children of Israel they shall have no inheritance.
    • • •
    26 Thus speak unto the Levites, and say unto them, When ye take of the children of Israel the tithes which I have given you from them for your inheritance, then ye shall offer up an heave offering of it for the Lord, even a tenth part of the tithe.
    • • •
    28 Thus ye also shall offer an heave offering unto the Lord of all your tithes, which ye receive of the children of Israel; and ye shall give thereof the Lord’s heave offering to Aaron the priest.

    2 Chr. 31: 5-6, 12
    5 ¶ And as soon as the commandment came abroad, the children of Israel brought in abundance the firstfruits of corn, wine, and oil, and honey, and of all the increase of the field; and the tithe of all things brought they in abundantly.
    6 And concerning the children of Israel and Judah, that dwelt in the cities of Judah, they also brought in the tithe of oxen and sheep, and the tithe of holy things which were consecrated unto the Lord their God, and laid them by heaps.
    • • •
    12 And brought in the offerings and the tithes and the dedicated things faithfully: over which Cononiah the Levite was ruler, and Shimei his brother was the next.

    And on and on and on…Nehemiah, more scriptures, Deuteronomy, Matthew speaks of it. Tithing has been around since the beginning. Abraham paid his tithing to Melchizedek. The law of Tithing is quite ancient. 10% of your increase. Donations are give what you can, of course. But tithing is a different principle (and as Malachi says, there is a promise attached to it).

  13. You are instructed to give 10% of your increase on a weekly basis. Sure the government takes its pound of flesh, sometimes more. But our increase is 100% of what we earned. Cheating and tithing from the net is not giving our firstfruits (off the top), and is robbing God (see below).

    I trade futures. I tithe when I take a profit distribution from my trading account. It would be silly to tithe on each day’s earnings, since I could lose the same amount the following day and then feel like God owes me that tithe back. Just tithe whenever an increase of whatever source becomes CASH. That is the only way to avoid using your own wisdom and make things complicated as a result.

    There are thieves and there are robbers. Thieves steal when nobody is around. Robbers steal from people by force. God calls those who do not tithe, and those who tithe less than they should, “robbers”, stealing from God by force. That’s pretty strong. Don’t do it.

  14. “But our increase is 100% of what we earned.”

    I have yet to read the LDS canon where this is explicitly stated. Many people have defined ‘increase’ as the monies which are left over after acquiring what we need to stay alive.

  15. I have yet to read the LDS canon where this is explicitly stated.

    Would a public, official statement of the First Presidency of the Church do? It was already provided above in comment 28.

  16. When I hear something like the following I’d probably take it very seriously indeed:

    “The position of the Church regarding the Negro may be understood when another doctrine of the Church is kept in mind, namely, that the conduct of spirits in the premortal existence has some determining effect upon the conditions and circumstances under which these spirits take on mortality and that while the details of this principle have not been made known, the mortality is a privilege that is given to those who maintain their first estate; and that the worth of the privilege is so great that spirits are willing to come to earth and take on bodies no matter what the handicap may be as to the kind of bodies they are to secure; and that among the handicaps, failure of the right to enjoy in mortality the blessings of the priesthood is a handicap which spirits are willing to assume in order that they might come to earth. Under this principle there is no injustice whatsoever involved in this deprivation as to the holding of the priesthood by the Negroes.”

    ~A Statement from the First Presidency, August 17, 1949

  17. First, you need to fully understand the position of blacks and the priesthood to understand the concept. What I read from this is that those of African descent may have been aware that they would have to wait to receive the priesthood, mainly due to the biases of men and not of God but that they (then) understood why. I must say I am glad that the term ‘Negro’ has been done away with since not all of African descent come from a Negro background.

    What this has to do with the discussion at hand, though, I do not know.

    You also don’t seem to understand the priesthood if you can equate that with my meaning.

    That statement was not canon, nor is everything that is said. But you can’t pick little pieces out of what is said by different men and women and decide to judge conduct or actions on just those things, taken out of context.

  18. So First Presidency letters are now considered canon? Interesting.

    Or perhaps it would be interesting if anyone here had ever said that.

    Honestly, Rick, you often claim that you like a good debate, but every time I think you’re on the verge of debating with me, you go off to that straw man of yours to argue with him instead.

    Why are you interested in a canonical statement of what constitutes income? Are you worried that Mormons might exercise some free thought or personal judgment?

    I’m also curious why you quoted a First Presidency statement on an irrelevant topic in comment 70. (Of course, I’ll have to trust that this is actually a First Presidency statement, rather than some comment made by an individual member of the First Presidency–you see the difference, don’t you? I’ll also have to trust that you haven’t made it up out of thin air, as you’ve been wont to do of late.)

    Here’s why I don’t think the quote above belongs here: First, it would be good to stay on topic, per the commenting policy. Second, it doesn’t support your point. Are you trying to pretend that the Church has reversed that position? The Church never said that it had always been wrong not to ordain blacks to the priesthood. What the Church said was that as of the time of the revelation given in 1978, it was now time to start ordaining them. Surely you can see the difference. So why ignore it and misrepresent the Church’s position?

  19. So First Presidency letters are now considered canon?

    Actually, what he said in response to your statement about canon was whether a letter from the First Presidency would suffice, not that it was indeed canon.

    That being said, what does the quote you provided have to do with the topic at hand, rick?

  20. “Honestly, Rick, you often claim that you like a good debate, but every time I think you’re on the verge of debating with me, you go off to that straw man of yours to argue with him instead.”

    Physician, heal thyself.

    “That being said, what does the quote you provided have to do with the topic at hand, rick?”

    Upon sober second thought, nearly nothing. You can probably delete it, if you so choose. I was popped, as I am wont to do, between discussion boards and it seemed on point at the time.

    “Would a public, official statement of the First Presidency of the Church do?”

    To the point – no. No amount of cajoling by any party would be enough to convince me to pay tithing. But it would make the life of the average lay-member considerably less worrisome if they’d canonize a specific interpretation, in my opinion.

  21. NO one is asking you to pay tithing. One needs to have a testimony of it in order to pay it. It doesn’t worry me at all to pay tithing, being an average lay-member, I am quite happy to, because it’s a commandment from God, not because the church asks for it.

  22. No amount of cajoling by any party would be enough to convince me to pay tithing.

    Ltbugaf’s comment was in response to your saying there was no source of canon defining when/how to pay tithing. It was in no way attempting to convince you to pay tithing. I’m really not too sure where your last few comments are coming from.

  23. Thses are some great questions
    on tithing. a lot of great comments.
    I always wonder how do you figure out what to give and in different money earning situations.
    This is great information. I have been receiving emails about Tithing and did not understand it. now you gave me some insight. i will check into this futher. look forward to your next writing

Leave a Reply