Murder or Molestation?

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{democracy:16}

Feel free to discuss.

34 thoughts on “Murder or Molestation?

  1. I have had a daughter molested by a neighbor boy. As bad as that was for her, and for us, she is still with us. We can see her smile and her laugh. She can heal, She can play her viola and visit with friends. What would I miss if she were not with us because her life was taken from us prematurely.

  2. tigersue

    I am so sorry for your daughter’s experience. I am so glad she is healing. You are right, she is with you and that is important.

    Kim created this poll because of an discussion he and I had regarding it. I feel that child molesters are more horrendous than murderers. Of course there are varying degrees to it as well, on both sides of it. I think both are evil, but I suppose my mother bear comes out when it comes to thinking child molesters get so little time incarceration before they are allowed out again.

  3. So Mary, you’re saying that you’d rather have your child murdered than molested?

    That seems less “mother bear”y than more…

  4. Rick, no, I would rather not EITHER. I am talking about the perpetrator. Not sure where you come to the conclusion that I would be more ok with one than the other. I am speaking from my thoughts on the person committing the crime. Anyone who harms a child in anyway in this regard is sick and shouldn’t be allowed out. I do anything to protect my children and everything I can.

  5. And for the record, I should say that I see both crimes on the same level. Now, I know not everyone would agree, but I think it is horrible that child molesters get barely a slap on the wrist and out they go again.

  6. I guess the answer varies if you focussing on the outcomes more than the criminals.

  7. I come from a bit of a different perspective too. Not just with this personal experience, but that molestation was rampant in my husbands family. There has had to be lots of healing and commitment that for us it stops here and now.
    (no it was not a family memeber that abused my daughter but a neighbor boy)

    My husband is also a professional counselor that works with sex offenders. He currently works in the prison close to our home. I think because of his job we are able to see beyond that sin and realize that they are also children of God. Does that mean I want them out on the streets if they are not ready, no, but if counseling can help them see their errors in thinking and action, and help them change inside than I’m glad my husband does what he does. I would like to think that he has helped other children not suffer.

  8. Anonymous

    Yes, you are right, they are also children of God. I suppose the hard thing though is when you see the abuse they do to children, it is hard (at least from my perspective) to look beyond that.

    From your husband’s experience, have any of his clients truly repented and never offended (to this point) again?

    I still see it as a horrendous crime and when some of these people are actively looking for ways to molest children, it sickens me. I see each child who has been so abused as my own. Rather, I can’t help but imagine how I would feel if it was my child.

    Ann, very true.

  9. Well, the original question was regarding the act, not the actor.

    That being the case, there is no doubt that murder is worse.

  10. I don’t recall any of the ten commandments addressing molestation, so hasn’t his question already been answered? =)

  11. I’ve always wondered about the prioritization of the big ten. You know, why are honoring thy father and mother on there, when things like say, child molestation or abuse, or even say, slavery, aren’t on there at all. Never have made sense of that.

  12. Probably because things like abuse, slavery and molestation should be a given. Unfortunately for some people they don’t seem to be. :(

  13. “abuse, slavery and molestation should be a given”

    …and murder shouldn’t?

    That logic doesn’t add up.

    There are old testament passages that actually condone sexual abuse on women.

  14. “…and murder shouldn’t?”

    Of course it should be a given. I was responding to Lisa’s specific comment.

    “There are old testament passages that actually condone sexual abuse on women.”

    Can you state references for these?

    I am not sure why you continue to attribute opinions to me that I do not state.

  15. Lisa says she’s ‘always wondered about the prioritization of the big ten. You know, why are honoring thy father and mother on there, when things like say, child molestation or abuse, or even say, slavery, aren’t on there at all’, and Mary replies ‘because things like abuse, slavery and molestation should be a given’; but that is exactly my point.

    If there are indeed ‘givens’ involved and if murder were a given, it wouldn’t have been listed. For that matter there probably wouldn’t have been a list at all. (I really do try to attribute the gist of ones argument to the correct person, please don’t take offense; none was intended)

    It’s pretty clear that there were no ‘givens’ in Mosaic law. What they cared about was written into the laws. There were no laws about the sexual abuse of women or girls. It might help to remember that when these laws were written, women were only slightly more valuable than goats or camels…

    You asked for examples in the old testament regarding socially sanctioned sexual abuse.

    Take Judges 19:22-29 which describes the sanctioned gang rape of an old man’s daughter and a priest’s concubine (the old man actually suggests it, and the priest does nothing to stop it).

    Or look at the story of Lot (remember him? the only good man in Sodom?) listed in Genesis 19 where Lot takes two angels as guests into his home. Then the house gets surrounded by the men of Sodom who once again wanted to ‘know’ the angels (that is indeed ‘know’ in the biblical sense).

    So what does Lot do to save his (male) angel guests? He gives the mob his two daughters to “do ye to them as is good in your eyes”. Wow if that’s the only good man in Sodom, I’d hate to meet one of the run-of-the-mill Sodomites…

  16. I don’t believe this is sanctioned by the Lord. Any of it. And perhaps there are mistranslations. Now I am not saying there was. But whether there were people who “sanctioned” such, or not, I know the Lord did not.

    And as I say, there should be givens in all moral issues. Unfortunately for some this isn’t enough. Or there wouldn’t be such heinous crimes perpetuated.

    The 10 commandments are basically a synopsis, but other more particular laws are explained elsewhere in the law of Moses. And perhaps (though I don’t think this is the case) child molestation wasn’t an issue in those days. Slavery was allowed under certain conditions.

  17. Mary, do you believe the Bible to be the inerrant word of God so far as it is translated correctly?

  18. The poll wasn’t which was worse for YOUR child just which was worse. Child molestation is worse if it is taken in general context. Murder is murder you can not do anything about it.. the family of the victim moves on. But coming from someone who was molestated at the age of 4 and at the age of 50 still sleeps with the lights on… there is no moving on with molestation. There is always the thought of the bogeyman under the bed and around the next dark corner.

    Now if the question was which would be worse for MY child? Of course murder would be. I would hope that I could fix the fears of the molestation in time.

  19. “…there is no moving on with molestation.”

    Ummm, Sally; there’s not a whole lot of ‘moving on’ going on when you’re dead either…

    When you molest a child, you rob them of their childhood and possibly scar them for life; when you kill someone you take something much more valuable – their entire life.

    Both are terrible, but I find it hard to understand how anyone can think that ANY living child is less better off than a dead one…

  20. Ok, my syntax today bites:

    That last statement should read:

    Both are terrible, but I find it hard to understand how anyone can think that ANY dead child is better off than a live one…

  21. Rick go back to Kim’s original post.. the question was which was worse murder or child molestation… it does not ask for murder of a child or molestation of a child… and going by that question to me in general.. child molestation is worse. With someone dead you will see them again in the next life. The question wasn’t even if murder of a person or a child molestation was of someone that you knew personally. I took it as a generalization. And I answered as such.

  22. …and on this point we must agree to disagree based on our opinions of what happens after we die.

    Given the opinion that death eliminates suffering and that we will see our loved ones in the afterlife, it seems that murder is the lesser of many, many other evils.

  23. “Both are terrible, but I find it hard to understand how anyone can think that ANY dead child is better off than a live one…”

    I don’t think anyone believes this, here. I certainly don’t. I just feel that a child molester is as bad as a murderer. I know I may be alone in this opinion (or at least in the minority) but my stance is on the perpetrator of the crime, not which is worse for the child or the family. I would never presume to make that decision for anyone.

  24. “I don’t think anyone believes this, here.”

    Sally just said it in #24.

    Sally, since you made the distinction between the murder of a child and murder in general, do you believe the murder of a child to be different than murder in general?

  25. re:10

    that’s because people are answering what they think the poll says, not what it really does.

  26. “With someone dead you will see them again in the next life. ”

    Are you implying that if a child is molested, we won’t see it in the next life? That statement just isn’t relative to the question.

  27. “Mary, do you believe the Bible to be the inerrant word of God so far as it is translated correctly?”

    Yes, the key being “as far as it is translated correctly”. However I don’t believe the ACTIONS of everyone in the Bible are the “word of God”. He has given us, all of us, freedom to choose how to act.

  28. The Old Testament is filled with examples of items considered righteous but not when viewed by today’s standards. Slavery, forced marriages and incest hardly seems like items to be condoned by a loving God.

    If your child who was accused of rape, would you support harsh punishment? The desire to punish those who commit crimes does not fit the imagine of followers of a man who preached forgiveness and do unto others as you would done unto you.

    Jesus preach a religion of love and forgiveness. Do you really follow what you preach?

  29. Pewsitter

    We are given the stewardship to watch over our children and protect them. The issue is not forgiveness in not letting a child molester out to do it again, to a child. It is our responsibility to protect them. One can forgive without allowing it to happen again. Would you let a known predator have access to your child, without your supervision?

  30. I will not let my children spend the night with children from my church until they are teenagers. It is not worth the risk to allow overnight visits. Good active men still molest children at night.

    I have a hard time with the concept of forgivness for the crimes of incest and rape yet what if it was my son who was accused. Would I want forgiveness for him?

    I have a hard time with parents who sacrifice their children for sex. With so much evil in the world, it is hard to truly follow the Savior and forgive others.

  31. “Good active men still molest children at night”

    What?!!

    I’m not sure what kind of good men you’ve been around, but in my neighbourhood, good men don’t molest any kids.

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