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	<title>Comments on: Taking the Lord&#8217;s name in vain</title>
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	<description>Thought-provoking commentary on life, politics, religion and social issues.</description>
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		<title>By: <img src='http://www.ourthoughts.ca/wp-content/plugins/rpx/images/facebook.png'/> Kim Siever</title>
		<link>http://www.ourthoughts.ca/2008/03/24/taking-the-lords-name-in-vain/comment-page-1/#comment-121067</link>
		<dc:creator><img src='http://www.ourthoughts.ca/wp-content/plugins/rpx/images/facebook.png'/> Kim Siever</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Jul 2009 21:17:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ourthoughts.ca/2008/03/24/taking-the-lords-name-in-vain/#comment-121067</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;To clarify, it wasn’t my list; it was Robert Millet’s list.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Thanks for your enlightening comment. :)&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;blockquote&gt;For the purpose of begging god for something selfish&lt;/blockquote&gt;

&lt;p&gt;That sure brings a whole new perspective to prayer.&lt;/p&gt;
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To clarify, it wasn’t my list; it was Robert Millet’s list.</p>
<p>Thanks for your enlightening comment. :)</p>
<blockquote><p>For the purpose of begging god for something selfish</p></blockquote>
<p>That sure brings a whole new perspective to prayer.</p>
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		<title>By: Kagehi</title>
		<link>http://www.ourthoughts.ca/2008/03/24/taking-the-lords-name-in-vain/comment-page-1/#comment-121066</link>
		<dc:creator>Kagehi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Jul 2009 21:14:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ourthoughts.ca/2008/03/24/taking-the-lords-name-in-vain/#comment-121066</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Oh, and.. just for a good laugh, the word &quot;Imprecatory&quot; comes from &quot;to impricate&quot;, which is defined as, &quot;to invoke evil&quot;. Talk about missing the frakking point...&lt;/p&gt;
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh, and.. just for a good laugh, the word &#8220;Imprecatory&#8221; comes from &#8220;to impricate&#8221;, which is defined as, &#8220;to invoke evil&#8221;. Talk about missing the frakking point&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Kagehi</title>
		<link>http://www.ourthoughts.ca/2008/03/24/taking-the-lords-name-in-vain/comment-page-1/#comment-121065</link>
		<dc:creator>Kagehi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Jul 2009 21:10:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ourthoughts.ca/2008/03/24/taking-the-lords-name-in-vain/#comment-121065</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Its not even a &quot;correct one&quot;. The original form, in Hebrew is:&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Nasa’ Shem Yehovah ‘Elohiym Shav’&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Don’t take up or accept the name of God with falsehood or emptiness.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;There are two interpretations I have seen of this version, one is based on an near identical line in Psalm 24:4, which differs only in a few words, and speaks to calling oneself a believer, and giving false faith, while not actually &lt;strong&gt;living as one&lt;/strong&gt;. Which, would basically cover most Christians, since a) the commandments (there are at least 5 versions, if you read an old enough Bible to not have this fact glossed over) it comes from are the &quot;first set&quot; given prior to their original breaking (the set given after doesn&#039;t include this, but does include following a bunch of Jewish holidays), and b) its now believed that mere belief is sufficient for salvation, which means on can say, do, claim and profess anything, and get saved, as long as they actually &quot;believe&quot; in Jesus. This is hardly the intent of the commandment... But, then.. How many of them do we follow in law, literally, as written, to today anyway?&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;The second interpretation I have seen is a more complex analysis of just what using gods name entails, and when and how you are and are not supposed to use it. The two cases where it is forbidden are 1) For the purpose of begging god for something selfish, and 2) demanding/requesting/suggesting to god that he do something to harm another. There are certain idiots in the US, all of them among so called &quot;Biblical Literalists&quot;, claiming to know the &quot;one true path&quot;, and insisting that only crazies like themselves are actually Christians, who use some variation of what one calls &quot;Imprecatory prayer&quot;. Prayer with the specific intent of demanding of god that he do something to certain people, including in the case of the man that brought it to my attention, god&#039;s killing of Obama via &quot;act of god&quot;, which very clearly falls under this interpretation. Its some idiot trying to tell his god what &lt;strong&gt;god&lt;/strong&gt; should be doing for them.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;The &quot;interpretation&quot; that implies 1 or 2 from your list didn&#039;t really show up until the a decade after the Protestant Revolution, when certain groups in that moment decided that they didn&#039;t like the &quot;language&quot; of certain people, or the tendency of some people to even question the validity of their definition of what god was, so starts shoving every case of irreverence, imagined sacrilege and common word that made them vaguely uncomfortable or seemed uncooth to them, into the same pile, and insisted that it all fell under that old commandment (one that, ironically, isn&#039;t even included in the &quot;final&quot; set of commandments that Moses supposedly gave his people, after the first set (or was it 4? its a damn muddle in those passages), got destroyed.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;In any case, the one you here the most often, literally, has jack shit to do with the commandment at all! Well, except in the specific case where the name of god, which means the &lt;strong&gt;literal&lt;/strong&gt; name, not just god, is used to attempt to curse someone, or conjure up miracles for personal gain (the two most common, and &lt;strong&gt;accepted&lt;/strong&gt; uses for his name in modern times).&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Its probably a good thing he likely doesn&#039;t exist. I am pretty sure, if he does, he is a whole hell of a lot more pissed off by the blasphemy of the millions of Christians in the world than the tens of thousands of atheists, like me, who just say, &quot;We are doing the best we can manage and trying to be nice, but.. we see no evidence, and if there was any, how do you find it among the billion+ idiocies of these people that claim to be following god?&quot; Just saying..&lt;/p&gt;
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Its not even a &#8220;correct one&#8221;. The original form, in Hebrew is:</p>
<p>Nasa’ Shem Yehovah ‘Elohiym Shav’</p>
<p>Don’t take up or accept the name of God with falsehood or emptiness.</p>
<p>There are two interpretations I have seen of this version, one is based on an near identical line in <a href="http://scriptures.lds.org/en/psalm/24/4#4" title="LDS Scriptures Internet Edition: Psalm 24:4">Psalm 24:4</a>, which differs only in a few words, and speaks to calling oneself a believer, and giving false faith, while not actually <strong>living as one</strong>. Which, would basically cover most Christians, since a) the commandments (there are at least 5 versions, if you read an old enough Bible to not have this fact glossed over) it comes from are the &#8220;first set&#8221; given prior to their original breaking (the set given after doesn&#8217;t include this, but does include following a bunch of Jewish holidays), and b) its now believed that mere belief is sufficient for salvation, which means on can say, do, claim and profess anything, and get saved, as long as they actually &#8220;believe&#8221; in Jesus. This is hardly the intent of the commandment&#8230; But, then.. How many of them do we follow in law, literally, as written, to today anyway?</p>
<p>The second interpretation I have seen is a more complex analysis of just what using gods name entails, and when and how you are and are not supposed to use it. The two cases where it is forbidden are 1) For the purpose of begging god for something selfish, and 2) demanding/requesting/suggesting to god that he do something to harm another. There are certain idiots in the US, all of them among so called &#8220;Biblical Literalists&#8221;, claiming to know the &#8220;one true path&#8221;, and insisting that only crazies like themselves are actually Christians, who use some variation of what one calls &#8220;Imprecatory prayer&#8221;. Prayer with the specific intent of demanding of god that he do something to certain people, including in the case of the man that brought it to my attention, god&#8217;s killing of Obama via &#8220;act of god&#8221;, which very clearly falls under this interpretation. Its some idiot trying to tell his god what <strong>god</strong> should be doing for them.</p>
<p>The &#8220;interpretation&#8221; that implies 1 or 2 from your list didn&#8217;t really show up until the a decade after the Protestant Revolution, when certain groups in that moment decided that they didn&#8217;t like the &#8220;language&#8221; of certain people, or the tendency of some people to even question the validity of their definition of what god was, so starts shoving every case of irreverence, imagined sacrilege and common word that made them vaguely uncomfortable or seemed uncooth to them, into the same pile, and insisted that it all fell under that old commandment (one that, ironically, isn&#8217;t even included in the &#8220;final&#8221; set of commandments that Moses supposedly gave his people, after the first set (or was it 4? its a damn muddle in those passages), got destroyed.</p>
<p>In any case, the one you here the most often, literally, has jack shit to do with the commandment at all! Well, except in the specific case where the name of god, which means the <strong>literal</strong> name, not just god, is used to attempt to curse someone, or conjure up miracles for personal gain (the two most common, and <strong>accepted</strong> uses for his name in modern times).</p>
<p>Its probably a good thing he likely doesn&#8217;t exist. I am pretty sure, if he does, he is a whole hell of a lot more pissed off by the blasphemy of the millions of Christians in the world than the tens of thousands of atheists, like me, who just say, &#8220;We are doing the best we can manage and trying to be nice, but.. we see no evidence, and if there was any, how do you find it among the billion+ idiocies of these people that claim to be following god?&#8221; Just saying..</p>
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		<title>By: <img src='http://www.ourthoughts.ca/wp-content/plugins/rpx/images/facebook.png'/> Kim Siever</title>
		<link>http://www.ourthoughts.ca/2008/03/24/taking-the-lords-name-in-vain/comment-page-1/#comment-46759</link>
		<dc:creator><img src='http://www.ourthoughts.ca/wp-content/plugins/rpx/images/facebook.png'/> Kim Siever</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Mar 2008 11:56:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ourthoughts.ca/2008/03/24/taking-the-lords-name-in-vain/#comment-46759</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;
  &lt;p&gt;But it doesn’t mean just that, right?&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;/blockquote&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Right. Which is the point of the post. Despite the fact it means much more, that&#039;s often the only part of it we hear.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;blockquote&gt;
  &lt;p&gt;I’m pretty sure that is the commandment.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;/blockquote&gt;

&lt;p&gt;That should say &quot;say&quot; instead of &quot;take&quot;. It&#039;s fixed now.&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote>
<p>But it doesn’t mean just that, right?</p>
</blockquote>
<p>Right. Which is the point of the post. Despite the fact it means much more, that&#8217;s often the only part of it we hear.</p>
<blockquote>
<p>I’m pretty sure that is the commandment.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>That should say &#8220;say&#8221; instead of &#8220;take&#8221;. It&#8217;s fixed now.</p>
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		<title>By: ltbugaf</title>
		<link>http://www.ourthoughts.ca/2008/03/24/taking-the-lords-name-in-vain/comment-page-1/#comment-46732</link>
		<dc:creator>ltbugaf</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Mar 2008 04:52:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ourthoughts.ca/2008/03/24/taking-the-lords-name-in-vain/#comment-46732</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I&#039;m sorry, I&#039;m just a little confused by what you wrote:&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;blockquote&gt;
  &lt;p&gt;...if taking the Lord’s name in vain means to speak profanity...&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;/blockquote&gt;

&lt;p&gt;But it doesn&#039;t mean just that, right?  Which is why Elder Oaks said it also means more.  And even though some profanity doesn&#039;t involve taking his name in vain, some does.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;blockquote&gt;
  &lt;p&gt;why isn’t the commandment: Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain?&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;/blockquote&gt;

&lt;p&gt;I&#039;m pretty sure that &lt;em&gt;is&lt;/em&gt; the commandment.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Honestly, I&#039;m not trying to be annoying; I&#039;m just confused.&lt;/p&gt;
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m sorry, I&#8217;m just a little confused by what you wrote:</p>
<blockquote>
<p>&#8230;if taking the Lord’s name in vain means to speak profanity&#8230;</p>
</blockquote>
<p>But it doesn&#8217;t mean just that, right?  Which is why Elder Oaks said it also means more.  And even though some profanity doesn&#8217;t involve taking his name in vain, some does.</p>
<blockquote>
<p>why isn’t the commandment: Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain?</p>
</blockquote>
<p>I&#8217;m pretty sure that <em>is</em> the commandment.</p>
<p>Honestly, I&#8217;m not trying to be annoying; I&#8217;m just confused.</p>
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