Mourning with those who mourn is not a baptismal covenant

Yesterday, I attended the baptism of a friend.

During the talk on baptism, the speaker quoted Mosiah 18:9

Yea, and are willing to mourn with those that mourn; yea, and comfort those that stand in need of comfort, and to stand as witnesses of God at all times and in all things, and in all places that ye may be in, even until death, that ye may be redeemed of God, and be numbered with those of the first resurrection, that ye may have eternal life—

She used it to indicate that one of the things we covenant to do when we are baptized is to mourn and comfort those who need it. Except, we don’t actually make that covenant at baptism.

Consider the next verse:

Now I say unto you, if this be the desire of your hearts, what have you against being baptized in the name of the Lord, as a witness before him that ye have entered into a covenant with him, that ye will serve him and keep his commandments, that he may pour out his Spirit more abundantly upon you?

Notice the difference in wording?

In verse 10, we see the actual covenant: serve the Lord and keep his commandment. In verse 9 (and verse 8 for that matter), what read is what led the people to the waters of Mormon.

What the speaker taught is—at least in my experience—a common teaching. I have seen and heard many people teach that comforting others is something we covenant to do, but the text doesn’t support that teaching.

That being said, I’m not advocating that we have an excuse to ignore people who have burdens, mourn, and need comfort. If I’m reading the text right, it seems that these desires sound like prerequisites for baptism. And that is not something commonly taught in the church.



Exploring baptism in EQ

In elders quorum class today, we had a great discussion about baptism.

The instructor started off by noting that the topic of baptism seems basic and hard to delve into, but I think our discussion disproved that position.

He started off asking the class to share how their view regarding baptism now compares to our view of it when we were baptized. Several of us shared our thoughts, and it was interesting that all who did were baptized at 8 years old. Continue reading Exploring baptism in EQ

Baptisms for the dead rub Catholics the wrong way

I found the following link through another website:

Vatican vs Salt Lake

In an effort to block posthumous rebaptisms by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, Catholic dioceses throughout the world have been directed by the Vatican not to give information in parish registers to the Mormons’ Genealogical Society of Utah.


Mormons have been criticized by several other faiths — perhaps most passionately by the Jews — for the church’s practice of posthumous baptism.

Any thoughts on this?

Begin to become accountable

While preparing for our nightly suppertime scripture study tonight, I came across this verse:

[Little children] cannot sin, for power is not given unto Satan to tempt little children, until they begin to become accountable before me. (D&C 29:47)

If one can begin to become accountable, does that mean accountability is a process? That a child is fully unaccountable at 8 years old minus one day and fully accountable at 8 years old?

Purpose of baptism

Likely because our oldest daughter is turning eight next month, I was recently thinking about baptism ?¢‚Ǩ‚Äù specifically regarding baptism in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. One of the things I was pondering is the purpose of baptism. I think its purpose is multi-faceted, and here are a few of the reasons I came up with why people are to be baptised (cultural reasons not included):

  • It’s a commandment
  • To follow Jesus’s example
  • As a sign of our covenant to mourn with and comfort others
  • As a sign of willingness to keep the commandments and remember Jesus
  • Because we want to be children of Christ
  • As a symbol of starting a new life
  • To live in heaven

Can you think of others?

Heads of Parents

I was reading D&C last night and a quote came to me or rather I should say a verse came to me where it stated it a child is not baptized by the time they turn 8 the sin will lie on the heads and shoulders of the parents. My question I put forth to this group… if the parents could not care less or have no intentions of doing so, then does the sin get transferred unto the grandparents shouldders? After all when we need assistance in our family we are counciled to go to our families first and foremost and if that is not available for whatever reason then they need to turn to the church for the next action. So would this not work two ways?